Podcast

Breaking the Shadows of Shame. Carol Chisolm

[00:00:00]

Welcome to the Unshakable Hope Podcast, where real life intersects redeeming love. I’m Kellie Hall, and this is where we wrestle through faith questions, such as how do I trust God’s heart when His ways and delays are breaking mine? We’ll hear from people just like you and me, who have experienced God’s faithfulness when life didn’t unfold as they expected.

My prayer is that God would renew our hope in His Word and His love through these conversations.

Kelly: Hey friends, I am so glad you’re here. We’re going to enjoy a conversation with an absolutely beautiful woman. She struggled for years with self hatred, shame, and fear. She was a victim of alopecia, but today she is a living, breathing, overcomer. Y’all, her story is authentic and inspiring. I’m so thankful to have Carol Chisholm with me [00:01:00] today. She is the author of a book called Breaking the Shadows.

She’s also a singer and songwriter. I just want you guys to know, I thoroughly enjoyed this book. Her vulnerability will touch your heart. The way she wrestles through the hard things in her life and met the Lord and the way he spoke to her through the word was so tender, so sweet. And in this book, she also included 10 original songs at the end of every single chapter, which have now been released over Spotify and Amazon.

She’s won multiple awards in gospel music categories over the last few years. Carol, I am so thankful you’re joining me for this conversation. Welcome to the podcast.

Carol: Thank you so much for having me. It’s a pleasure to meet you.

Kelly: Oh, this is wonderful. If you watch this on YouTube, you’ll be able to see a lovely picture of the cover of her book in the background.

Carol, I thoroughly enjoyed how vulnerably you walked us through your story. . And I wonder if you can share the [00:02:00] backstory to the title. Your title is Breaking the Shadows. And what’s the subtitle?

Carol: How to embrace your true self and live in the light of God’s glory.

Kelly: . Where did that title come from?

Carol: Well, the shadows, you know, shadows can only exist when there is a light source. So the shadow is cast as a result of an object that blocks light from the source, remove the object, and there is no more shadows. So that the object for me was fear, shame, self hatred because of the alopecia and God removed that from me.

And so breaking the shadows was what we came up with as a result of what I had been through, what I had endured because for years, many, many years, I just hid in shadows. Even though I was born again, I [00:03:00] was saved and was singing, leading worship, ministering.

Kelly: Yeah.

Carol: But still, I was hiding myself. I was hiding the fear.

Kelly: Yeah.

Carol: God broke those shadows for me.

Kelly: Yeah. And we talk a lot on this podcast about wrestling through everything that stands in the way of walking in our freedom in Christ. And that’s what you’re talking about, breaking out from the lies and the fears and the self hatred of this disease called alopecia.

So explain to us what alopecia is and also just how the realization that you had this autoimmune disease, how that took place in your life.

Carol: Okay. Well, alopecia is an autoimmune disorder that attacks your hair follicles and it causes baldness. Basically, , my immune system thinks my hair is a foreign object and so it works to eliminate it.

And for years I did not want to face the fact [00:04:00] that I had this condition. There are so many different types of alopecia and I rejected the fact that I had it because growing up there was a young lady in my church who had alopecia. It was the kind that they called universalis, which means she had no hair anywhere on her body.

And

so that was my reference for alopecia. So I knew, oh, this is not what I have. This something else is going on. And then just not wanting to accept that reality that. This is what was happening

Kelly: I can see how that would happen. I mean, 3 of my 4 children are profoundly deaf. And my 1st born, wasn’t diagnosed till she was 15 months old because of a variety of reasons, but you just get used to something.

It starts to seem normal. She was slow to respond when I called her name. And I just thought she was [00:05:00] stubborn. You write a story that excuses the issues. And I think that’s kind of what you are doing. , this can’t be a disease. I will just fix it by using more products and . More techniques to cover up bald spots. It unfolded. So slowly

Carol: it did. I had just had my, my 1st born and he was about 9 months old. And at the time we were living in Europe. My husband’s retired military. And so. I took my son home to Oklahoma at to meet the family.

Kelly: Yeah.

Carol: Then, from that point there, I had a vocal cord surgery and I had something done on my hair chemicals put on my hair, but they used to call a Jerry curl.

So I thought. That maybe it was a combination of two things colliding that all just caused me to, you know, have hair loss. I had [00:06:00] just, like I said, just had my son nine months old. Maybe it was just a combination of a lot of things happening.

Kelly: Yeah.

Carol: But when it happened, it was so dramatic. But then over the years, it was a slow process.

So by the time I had got, I got back , from Oklahoma to Europe about three weeks and I could run my hand through my hair and I had a handful of hair. And so it thinned out terribly. And I had a bald spot in the very top of my head. From that point, I could mask it a little, even with the thinning, it was super thick.

So just even then, was just a traumatic event for me. And so after it continued to thin, like it would, it grew back a little bit and then it started falling out again. So I went through the process of when I had enough hair, I would braid it. And then when I [00:07:00] didn’t have any more hair to catch on to to braid, I would use what they call a quick weave.

Well, then I didn’t have any more hair on the top of my head. I can still grow hair around the back, nothing on the top. So I was confined to wearing wigs. And that, like I said, it was a slow process from each stage from the Braids to the wigs, to the weaves to the wigs, and then to finally just acknowledging that this, this is what’s going on.

Kelly: Yeah. Well, I thought the way it unfolded is just applicable to every person’s life. You know, we all have some insecurities. We all have some lies or fears that become embedded in our heart on our journey. Some from our childhood and many of yours started in childhood. I’d love for you to just talk about some of the insecurities and lies that became embedded in your heart.

Carol: Basically the lies were just [00:08:00] Insecurities. You’re not good enough. You’re not pretty enough. You’re ugly. No man would want you. And so that caused friction in my marriage.

Not that my husband rejected me or anything like that. I basically felt like our vows said for better, for worse. He didn’t buy into baldness.

 

Carol: And I pushed him away. I tried to push him away so that I felt he deserved better. Hmm. And it made me feel lonely. It made me feel isolated because I was too embarrassed to tell anybody.

Only a few friends knew. Hmm. But I was too embarrassed to even show myself to my husband. You know, you share intimate moments in the bathroom when you’re brushing your teeth and he’s on the other in the other sink [00:09:00] vanity combing his hair or something. All that stopped. I would not allow him to just come into the bathroom.

He had to knock on the door, even in the bedroom. When I’m getting dressed, the door was closed because I didn’t want him to see me. I walked in so much shame. And so it was just a very dark time for me.

Kelly: Yeah. And he was so loving and supportive

Carol: he never once not a bad word to me. Not a mean word.

, nothing. My kids the same way, always loving, always. , we got you mom, but I couldn’t face it myself.

Kelly: Yeah. You didn’t even want to look in the mirror at your bald head that was very hard for you. So you wore wigs and there was even one point where the people in your own faith community rejected you and wounded you.

[00:10:00] You don’t have to talk about this, but since it’s in your book, do you mind sharing it?

Carol: , yeah, it’s fine. I think I’ve recovered from that. I’m no longer in that church community, that faith community. Moved on to another faith community. That’s it’s accepting and inviting. And so, I was basically rebuke for something that was just.

Uncalled for. I didn’t come to church one night because I was my, my child was young. He was asleep. I was exhausted. So I decided I would stay home. I think God forgives us right?

Kelly: There’s not even forgiveness required for that. You were, you were tired. You stayed home. You were at church quite often and.

Quite often.

Carol: Yeah. And immediately when I walked in and sat on the back pew, because I was late after [00:11:00] being demanded to come.

I was called bald headed.

Kelly: In front of the whole

congregation.

Carol: In front of the whole congregation.

Kelly: I am so sorry that happened to you. The wounding I know that gave your heart was just, it really hurt me to hear about that. It was humiliating. It was hurtful. And because you were overseas, you really didn’t have another faith community you could go to. You didn’t have family you could go to. So lonely and difficult.

And you did nothing wrong. There was nothing that you did wrong.

Carol: Yeah, and I just buried it. It was so deeply. Embedded in me that I just kept pushing it down because we dare not say anything because you would be isolated. And I didn’t, I was already isolated.

I was thousands of miles from my family. And it was at the time, just my husband and myself. So, you know, you just grin and bear it and you keep going. Even those scars that. Wound us [00:12:00] and affect our hearts. We just. Keep going with them.

Kelly: Yeah. And those wounds just went deeper and deeper and there was more and more shame.

So I’m thankful the Lord walked you out of it. He broke you out of the shadows. He broke you out of the prison of fear and self hatred. And that was beautiful to see along the way. As I mentioned, you, you included The lyrics to songs you’ve written at the end of each chapter, and they were really meaningful, they were songs that God gave you along the way to minister to your heart.

I’m wondering if you could just share about one of those, how God brought that message of hope to your heart.

Carol: The very first song that he gave me was, it’s called wonderfully made. And I sometimes write in pictures and this one was playing like a movie in my head.

Really?

Yeah. I saw it as he was giving it to me.

I saw the video as [00:13:00] he was giving it to me. And it was just like, I knew it was the Lord because Usually I’m just, I’m writing and I can just sense that this is what he wants me to do. But this one was so vivid because that’s what my, I guess one of the scriptures that I really, really just embraced was I’m wonderfully made.

I’m fearfully and I’m wonderfully made, but we don’t, we, we stopped there. Sometimes we don’t go on to the rest of that scripture where he says, And my soul knows right. Well, I had to be convinced of this, that I made no matter whether I’m bald or not, that God made me reverently. He made me respectfully.

He made me intently. He made me with so much love and care that I, I had to believe that. And I started to believe that. [00:14:00] So the song, basically the lyrics start with There in the mirror staring at me, someone I don’t want to be. And it was like, it took me through the hurt from childhood through me looking in the mirror and not wanting to be this person and then how, and at the bridge that God doesn’t make mistakes.

Hmm. He never makes mistakes. So whatever it is that we go through, whatever it is that the outcome, the result, if it’s baldness, if it’s, I don’t know, any scar that you’ve had, any trauma that you’ve experienced, it’s not a mistake. He’s going to get glory out of it. When we’re going through it, it absolutely feels like This can’t be right.

There’s something really wrong here, but God will get the glory. Yeah, He will [00:15:00] get the glory.

Kelly: I love how you brought out the second part of that scripture. So it’s Psalm 139, 14 and 15, I believe. Where it says you are fearfully and wonderfully made. And then yes, my soul knows it very well. So it’s this, and I’m working through some things too, where I’m declaring out loud, what I know to be true about who God made me to be about who God is.

And it helps so much when you say it out loud and you just say, I choose to believe God, who you say I am, I choose to believe it. And it’s an intentional act of the will. Yes, yes,

absolutely.

That’s a beautiful story. I love to imagine that moment where you’re just seeing this movie play through your mind and God is just downloading this song and showing you what it means and giving you the lyrics and the music.

Carol: It is. It was amazing. Like I said, he gave me the lyrics and the concept for a video all at the same time. So I’m watching this [00:16:00] like, okay, well, let’s do it this way. Let’s do it this way. And it all came together and Yeah, so it was the very first song that he gave me when I call my Bald Reveal,

your bald reveal

I came out came out.

Kelly: I love that. Can we watch that video on YouTube? Yes. Okay, why don’t you send me that link and we’ll put it in the show notes. Okay.

And so let’s talk about your bald reveal for a year, you were kind of working through this. Okay. I’m going to take my wigs off.

You felt God was telling you to be free just to be bald and you asked your family and they’re all like, yes, go, we’re all behind you, but it took you a year before you had the courage to do it. So talk to us about that. That was so fun to read about.

Carol: ,

Oh gosh, I was disobedient for a whole year.

 

Kelly: You were wrestling

Carol: for a whole year. God, you were so faithful to me, but [00:17:00] yeah. So for the year before my reveal, I would have thoughts, not really knowing and realizing that it was the Holy spirit’s urging.

Yeah.

I got you. God’s got you. Let’s do this. you’re going to get, we’re going to get the glory.

Don’t you worry about it. We’ll be with you. And just as I was getting ready to, like you said, I talked to my husband. He’s like, you’re beautiful either way. I don’t care. I said, so you’ll hold my hand in public. He says, yes, I will hold your hand in public. I will kiss you in public. I will kiss your head in public.

I love you. And whatever you want to do is fine with me. My kids the same way. We got you mom, you know, when you’re getting ready, it’s like when you’re at the cliff. And you’re getting ready to jump off into the water. That’s the scariest part. And so you have to make a decision right then and there whether you’re [00:18:00] going to stay on that cliff or you’re going to jump in.

Well, I got scared and I decided that and, and I’m thinking, God, you know, you, this, this really couldn’t have been your thought. This couldn’t have been your will, your mind, because you would never want me to be embarrassed. You would never want me to feel humiliated. So I just dismissed it and said, you know, it’s, it’s probably just me.

And a year later. Almost to the date,. I’m praying my prayers always been, I want God to get the glory in my life. And so I’m weeping and, and wailing in prayer, God, I want you to get the glory, get the glory in my life. He said. Not like before, like, like Elijah, the still small voice. No, it was more a voice of annoyance for me.

Kelly: Like a thunder.

 

Carol: It was like, how can [00:19:00] anybody , give me glory if they never know your struggle? And I knew that God this is you. I hear you Lord. Okay. I know what you want me to do.

 

Kelly: God knows. He knows how long it’s going to take. He knows what we have to sort through. He understands and he’s so tenderly and compassionately. Walks us into these places of deeper freedom. He’s so tender with us

Carol: He is. I remembered the story of, Moses and all the excuses that Moses gave God.

I can’t talk. I can’t do this. And they won’t believe me. And who will I say sent me? And , I can picture God just being like, how long are we going to keep going through this? I told you that I’m going to do. And so what are you waiting for? So I feel like he talks to me like that.

Right. So I just believe he was sitting there and like, [00:20:00] okay, You keep saying this prayer, how, how is this going to happen if they never know what you’re going through? How are you going to help anybody?

Yeah.

How are you going to encourage anybody? They don’t know what you’re going through. You have to be vulnerable.

Basically, you have to be transparent so that people can touch you. Jesus was transparent. He was able to be touched. People can’t touch you if they don’t know what you’re going through

 

Kelly: He touched the leper. He was up close and personal. I mean, every story you see, he is personally ministering to people who need him.

He’s not behind the scenes. He’s not distant. He is an up close and personal and present God. And that’s what you experienced.

Carol: Yes.

Kelly: I love the vulnerability in your book. So you certainly follow the Lord into authenticity. And that’s what made , your story so beautiful to read. One of the hardest moments [00:21:00] that you describe in your book is when you were actually walking

into a store by yourself for the first time, but God just spoke some words of comfort to you. So that was a big move. So just tell us how that unfolded.

Carol: That was very scary.

Yeah.

Because the day before my husband had gone to the store with me.

Good man.

It’s like, I know nobody’s going to bother me with my husband, with me, like my protector, my guard, nobody’s going to say anything.

And I’m purposely looking people in the face thinking, okay, don’t you see me? Do you see me?

I dare you to say anything.

Yeah. Yeah. And I had a shirt because when I did my reveal, I had a photo shoot and I coined a phrase, right? I have alopecia, but it doesn’t have me. I love that. And I wore that shirt to the store.

And so I’m thinking, okay, they’re going to look [00:22:00] and see, and then they’re going to look at my head and say something. Do you see, do you see? Nobody said anything because they have their own problem. Yeah. But the next day I went to the store by myself When I got out of the car, trying to put one foot in front of the other felt like I was in quicksand.

Wow.

Because I was so fearful of the stares that I would get, the whispers I would hear. I was really afraid. So I walked into the store and I did my shopping. Like, I wasn’t as bold as, you know, when your big brothers with you or your protectors with you. Well, when my husband was with me, I knew nobody was going to say anything, but this time it’s like, So I’m trying to avoid people this time.

Yeah.

Until I get to the register. The line and the, those two little [00:23:00] girls in front of me and I, they were whispering and looking at me and it’s like, I know it’s coming. All right. Brace yourself. Just brace yourself. What are they going to say? They said absolutely nothing about my head. , they liked my earrings.

Oh, so

sweet. They liked my shirt. They anything other than Right?. And so they begin to talk to me about their pets and we had a conversation about how old they are and. And here is the funny thing, Kelly. The two young girls were barefoot and they were not as clean.

Yeah,

They’d been out playing clearly, but what it taught me.

Is that I had formed an opinion about them. They’re barefoot. They’re dirty. They’re going to talk about [00:24:00] me, but they did not form an opinion about me. They passed no judgment on me. So it taught me to, when, when you look at people, just like you want them to look at you and not pass judgment, you have to do the same thing and look at people and pass no judgment.

Be understanding, be loving, be available, be vulnerable, be able to be touched. And so it’s gave me such a wonderful, lesson those little girls, they weren’t worried about my head . Not one time, why are you bald? Now, I invite people to ask, I’d rather you ask than stare.

So that way I can share the love of God with you.

Yeah. Beautiful. The way God unfolded all that in your heart. And I know that day when you were getting out of the car, even for your photo shoot, that was the first time you had stepped out [00:25:00] into the openness without a wig on, and I don’t know how long.

Yes. And the, the photographer, okay, what’s she going to say? She said, you’re Carol and you’re beautiful.

And it

just broke the ice for me.

Yeah.

And then that camera was loving on me. Hear me. Oh yeah. It was, it’s been an experience. And even after the little girls, I experienced with them, I went to another store and.

experienced an adult. And that was kind of really disturbing and troubling to me because the lady was watching me from across the store. I could see her and she was walking toward me. And the closer she got to me, the more uncomfortable I got because she kept staring and I didn’t want [00:26:00] her to say anything to embarrass me because I was standing again in the line

with a lot of people.

She gets to me and she says, I’ve been watching you from across the store. She says, you’re absolutely stunning. And I just began to cry, but I was able then to, to share with her why, why I’m bald. Why is this lady walking around with no hair? Some people think that it’s just, it’s a fashion statement.

No, I would love to have hair, but that’s not where I am right now. God has me in this place where I can minister to people who have maybe invisible scars on their heart or, or visible scars.

Yeah.

But I can talk to them and tell them how he delivered [00:27:00] me, how he set me free from shame, from fear, from even self hatred.

I hated myself. There was nothing about me that I liked.

Kelly: That just breaks my heart. I’m so grateful. That God is always in the business of soul healing, and he’s always pursuing our hearts. He’s, he is very intentional about this, and he’s deeply invested in your story, in our stories, and he didn’t want any of us to spend one day trapped in the prison of lies.

Right. You’re right.

And I was, so I’m curious, this, the picture on the front of your book of you, was that from the Photoshoot that day. Not that day. Okay. Okay. Okay. Well, you’re rocking it, my friend. You are beautiful. But even more than that, you have a beautiful heart of faith. I’m wondering if you could talk about the time when God when it was raining and how [00:28:00] God just ministered to you ministers to you in those places of rain.

My daughter in law, God often allows her to feel his presence when it’s raining. And it always seems to rain on significant days in her life, like her wedding day and the birth of her, our first grandchild, which just happened recently on June 1st. Wonderful. Congratulations. Thank you.

Carol: Well, the rain represents to me, renewal, revival, refreshing.

You know, it’s like when I was a kid, I would go outside after the rain, and it was just a fresh smell, the aroma of the rain was just wonderful to me. And when I shaved my hair, when, when God said, you know, can’t give me glory if they don’t know your struggle. And remember, I can still grow hair around the back of my head.

[00:29:00] So I got up immediately from prayer and I went in the bathroom and I shaved what was left. Wow. And then I went to my piano and just started to play and be, and I was home alone before I know it, the rain started and it was beating against the wall. And I’m just playing and kind of just worshiping God.

And he said to me, what does the rain represent? And I remembered that fresh aroma, that fresh smell, the fragrance of it being new and crisp. And, it was an amazing moment with me and with God. And I just started to cry and shed tears and begin to thank him for the renewal. Thank you for reviving me.

Thank you for rejuvenating me. Thank you for [00:30:00] transforming me. Thank you that I’m no longer walking in shadows. I’m no longer walking in the darkness. I’m no longer hiding myself from myself. Yeah, so that’s what I was doing. God knows. Nothing is hidden before him. So I’m covering up, I’m disguising myself under wigs, under weaves, whatever the case was, I’m hiding from people.

I’m hiding my shame. But God says no more. There’s no need for you to be ashamed because you’re fearfully and wonderfully made and I’m not looking at your outward appearance anyway. God looks on your heart and that’s what he wants. He wants us to have that heart where that he can use to be able to bless people, the heart posture that’s for him and only [00:31:00] for him.

And so it was just it was just a wonderful experience. An amazing moment.

Kelly: I love that. You know, he says in his word in Isaiah 43, 18 and 19, that he’s doing a new thing. He is always doing a new thing. But in that moment, it was like he invited you into this very significant new thing. It’s like it marked this moment in your life where you could look back and say, I’m free.

I broke out of the shadows. God broke me out of prison. He busted me out.

Carol: Yes. And he, he did, and it took the power of God

because I had struggled with this for 30 years. In the faith community that humiliated me and wounded me and had it, the Lord just arranged it. And to where at the time that he, he, he had to remove us.

Yeah.

He had to remove [00:32:00] us, uproot us out of that environment, because I never could have been so vulnerable. I never could have uncovered myself. Without being wounded further,

Kelly: right. That was not a safe group of people. It wasn’t a safe place.

Carol: I could not have. So God had to allow us to go through some things in that community, take us out of it. And then I was free. He released me then it was like, okay, . I got you. And Isaiah says, when you go through the fire, he’ll be with you. When you go through the floods, the water won’t overtake you. That’s where I am. I’ve gone through the fire, but he’s not, it’s not overtaking me. It’s not. It’s not, I’m like Abednego, not even a stench.

Yeah.

And so it’s just been [00:33:00] amazing what God has done is doing through what I would have considered horrible. Yeah. I did consider awful, dreadful, traumatic.

Kelly: Yes. And for you personally, it’s so interesting that you grew up for some reason, just idolizing long hair, like everywhere you look, there’s long hair and you thought that’s what I, and so it was almost an idol for you.

And so losing your hair was more significant for you because it, it just attacked the , the deepest desire of your heart. And that’s what you had seen the, most significant people are those with long hair and so you somehow started wrapping your identity around that, but thankfully God set you free and you are beautiful and you no longer need to hide.

In the shadows behind your wigs. And I’m so glad, thank you for sharing your story with us. , are there any other words of hope and freedom that you would like [00:34:00] to leave with our listeners?

Carol: Sure. We all have insecurities and imperfections that have caused us to retreat into the shadows. And prevent us from walking in our purpose, , walking in who God created us to be. Maybe you’re not hiding in the shadows of shame due to alopecia. Your shame may be addiction or trauma, visible scars, aging, regret, low self esteem. Whatever the case may be, that shadow can be broken.

Trust God. Embrace your true, authentic self. And live in the light of God’s glory.

Kelly: Yeah. Amen. One of the things I pray regularly in the morning is God just help me say the deepest, truest things to you. Help me believe the deepest, truest things. And one of the things I had, I have a prayer [00:35:00] that’s written out and it says, , it says, God loves how he made you.

You’re a masterpiece. And someone said that they had heard a pastor say, you’re not the frame around the masterpiece. You’re not the screw holding the masterpiece on the wall. You’re the masterpiece. And you have infinite worth because of who created you.

And that’s your beauty. That’s your worth. Lord, I choose to believe that I am your beautiful creation, that you love me, you value me, and you see me through eyes of love every time you look at me.

Carol: And he does, but I like what you said that we have to choose to believe it.

Kelly: Yeah, it is a choice. And so it helps to even declare it out loud. The things you know that are true. God, I’ve noticed that I’m kind of walking in a place of insecurity. I’m not walking in my truest identity, but so right now I’m going to just start declaring I am fearfully and wonderfully made. I know it. I know it’s [00:36:00] true.

I’m a masterpiece. I’m not a misfit. That’s how I have felt before. And I’m just going to believe it today. Yes. Well, I want to recommend, I do recommend Carol’s book, Breaking the Shadows, and I will have links in the show notes. And also Carol’s going to send me a link for one of her songs, that video. So I hope you get a chance to listen to that and enjoy her book as well.

Carol, thank you so much for being with us today.

Carol: Thank you so much. I really enjoyed it.

If you were encouraged in your faith today, it’d be great if you’d help get the word out by subscribing, sharing with a friend or leaving a review. I’d love to hear from you. You can reach out through my website, kellyhall. org and pick up some free resources while you’re there. Thanks for listening to the Unshakable Hope Podcast.