Podcast

Living Fearlessly in our True Identity. Tara Oellette

[00:00:00] Welcome to the Unshakable Hope Podcast, where real life intersects redeeming love. I’m Kellie Hall, and this is where we wrestle through faith questions, such as how do I trust God’s heart when His ways and delays are breaking mine? We’ll hear from people just like you and me, who have experienced God’s faithfulness when life didn’t unfold as they expected.

My prayer is that God would renew our hope in His Word and His love through these conversations.

Hey friends, we are really going to have some fun today. You are going to love my guest, Tara Ouellette a joy field life coach who teaches others how to kick fear to the curb and follow spirit led practices into abundant, transformed living through her ministry. Abundantly me. She also blesses many others through her coaching for Jamie and Donna Winship’s ministry called Identity [00:01:00] Exchange. Now if you’re a regular listener to this podcast, you’ve heard me quote Jamie Winship and heard me recommend his excellent book titled, Living fearless, exchanging the lies of the world for the liberating truth of God. It’s a fabulous book that I’ve been through several times and so has my husband. Tara and I are going to be talking about the process of recognizing and surrendering our false identities so that we can walk out of the fear, lies, guilt, and shame. And open our hearts up wide to receive the powerful truth of who God tells us we actually are.

You are going to hear some fabulous stories, some from Tara’s life, some from mine, and one amazing story out of Jamie’s book.

I hope you’ll stick around for the end because Tara does such a beautiful job walking us through this process and also praying over us. So Tara, welcome. I am so glad we’ve finally been able to connect and have this [00:02:00] conversation.

Tara: Thank you, Kelly. Thanks for having me.

Kelly: I would love it if you would start by just telling us a little about your family.

Tara: Yes, I am married to my best friend. , that’s not just a statement. , my husband and I are raising three wonderful warriors, young men. They’re 21, 19, and 16. And we live in Clarkston, Michigan. It’s the Detroit area, Southeast area of Michigan. And it’s such a delight. I love how technology connects us.

Kelly: Yes, me too. Three boys. Wow. I love the description of them as warriors. Do you have one or two of them in college?

Tara: Yeah, two college age kids on their journey. A lot more independence. And then the high schooler. Just more and more independence. And we’re really excited about truly what the topic is today. Just watching them learn about who God says they are and to be a mom that raises them to believe that they also can live [00:03:00] fearlessly in their true identity.

So I’d love to talk about, I tried it right now in my parenting teen boy years.

Kelly: I wish I knew what I know now when I was parenting my kids when they were younger. They’ve survived though,

Tara: Sure do; God throughout it all. But yeah, that would be nice.

Kelly: Yeah. Well, we’re going to be talking about the book, living fearless, but primarily we’re going to be talking about the principles of how to discover your identity, how to move past fears and false identities so that we can embrace the true identity from Christ.

The one that he knit together in our mother’s womb that’s described in Psalm 139 so what I wanted to do, Tara, because you have such a telling story and it helps highlight some of those places of transformation that happened in our lives. I’d love for you to tell us about your childhood and your professional life.

[00:04:00] Primarily focusing on the lies and false identities that you believed. And I know that then we’ll get into how stumbling upon Jamie Winship, God set you free.

Tara: Yes. It’s such an amazing journey, you know, and for me and like the rest of us we start developing lies about God. Not that I even really knew God growing up.

I wasn’t raised in the church. But that in and of itself, that. There wasn’t a God or that it wasn’t needed. I mean, that’s a belief system. And so we believe lies about God, about ourselves and about each other and just the way the world works. And it’s a very scarcity, fear based mindset. So my childhood was like many others.

Just, I collected along the way based on circumstances. And people in my lives or lack of people in my life I just started to believe lies about mostly about myself. I was very fear based because of the background in my [00:05:00] childhood. I easily agreed with the fear and the scarcity scarcity of money, scarcity of time, scarcity of intelligence as a student, scarcity of parenting and not having a dad at home.

You know, coming from just a divorce family scenario believing lies about myself, that I was dumb, that I was alone, that I was abandoned, that I’m, you know, not good enough to have my dad choose our family. and I just learned to have a lot of faith in myself. And that’s scary. So, yeah, so I grew up like all of us do we collect this in our childhood years.

And so I carried that mindset into education, into being a teacher. And I was a really good teacher. I mean, I was not a good student K through 12, and I had this passion for education. And so I took those lies and I masked them in A college degree and successes [00:06:00] and I look real good on the surface.

Tara: I was accomplished. I set goals and I achieved them and I had a great marriage, which both my husband and I didn’t have a lot of examples of that. And, you know, so we, in our own strength, flip the script of the lies we believed, but it was through our behaviors and our actions and striving and some self protection and self promotion.

Yeah, that had to come to an end at some point in time, but I looked very successful while believing a lot of fear based lies about myself.

Kelly: Yeah, you were very successful. You were even promoted to principal and you were such a good teacher. You cared. About the students, you were always ministering in such powerful ways and seeing transformation in those you taught, but still you were trapped in this lie that you’re, how would you define it?

That your accomplishments defined you? Is that how you would say it?

Tara: Yes, Kelly. Exactly. Those are false [00:07:00] securities. Those are false identities. We can be identified by poverty. I can be identified by, you know, being abandoned by my dad, for an example. But I also could be identified by promotions and titles and the amount of money we were successful.

So we can be labeled and have these “I am” statements that are false. And it’s not that they’re not you know, true in my perspective and that they’re horrible to say. It’s just, it’s not the truth of who I am, but that’s how I was operating. And so what that means is evidence of that is I was dependent on the highs and lows.

I was dependent on the highs. I was dependent on the successes. Both my husband and I, you know, with income. So when we know we’re being identified by these circumstances, high or low we go high and low often , our happiness and joy can be dictated by those labels and circumstances and it’s emotional and it kind [00:08:00] of whips you around and spits you out and.

Yeah, God loved me way in even before I fully knew who he was because we developed our faith later in our twenties and thirties. He loves us so much. He’s always hovering. He’s always hovering over us in our formlessness and like our lies. And he’s like, I can’t wait for you to meet me and meet yourself, the truth of who you are.

And yeah, that happened.

Kelly: Yes. He just surrounds us. His hand is on us. He’s just leading us into freedom, but there’s a lot of our story that happens before we’re able to walk into that freedom. And one of the things you mentioned too, is That one of the ways we can be alerted that there are lies is we will often resort to self protection and self promotion, right?

Okay.

Tara: It’s in our efforts.

Kelly: Yeah. Okay. And maybe the way it presents itself is you’ll get defensive when somebody says something or you’ll notice that you’re talking about your accomplishments when [00:09:00] you’re in a room of people

Tara: yeah.

You’ll offended a lot. You can get your feelings hurt. You feel good when you’re acknowledged, you feel alone and lost and stuck when you’re not acknowledged. And that’s what can be interesting because I didn’t think of myself as like self promoting prideful

Right.

Security in people, promoting and seeing and like not even affirming more like validating my existence.

That’s what we feel. If we’re really honest and we pause in the moment, we’re like, wow, I’m really dependent on that person’s approval. Oh, yeah. You can feel that. We know we can feel that even in our fullness, even on the other side of my journey, it’s like, whoop, there it is. I can feel that I, you know, and that’s not a bad thing. It’s just an indicator. And for me, that indication was. it was on the rise and fall of the people, the [00:10:00] word and the opinion of man.

Kelly: Okay. That’s so good. One of the things that Jamie Winship will often say is emotions like the fears and the lies and the defensiveness. Some of the things you described are invitations into transformation.

Tara: This is what I do for a living. I love that. It’s the best. It isn’t the best to feel the unpleasant emotions. That’s pretty yucky. That feels awful. But it’s Always an invitation into transformation always

right.

Kelly: And one of the things I always say is if when God reveals it, he’s going to heal it.

So we don’t have to be afraid to go there. Let’s just walk into that beautiful invitation. One of Jamie Winship’s quotes that I love so much is the greatest part of who you are is just beyond your deepest fear. And I would think a lot of people would say, Oh I’m not afraid. I’m a strong, courageous person, but I love the story.

Jamie tells where he gathers all these CEOs in a room. And then he says, go around and [00:11:00] introduce yourself. And they all talk about their power, their wealth, their position . Okay. So they’re self promoting in front of this room. And then he says. I know nothing about any of you now go back around and tell me what is your deepest fear and every single one of their fears is related to the idea that I’m afraid I’m going to fail. I am a failure. I’m not enough.

Tara: It’s the human condition.

It’s a great connector of this world, human to human. That’s where we get real true. That’s the truth. That’s where we connect as humans. That’s where we connect to God.

It’s in the truth.

Kelly: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that’s so good.

As God began to call me to do a new website and to start a podcast was he had to rid me of a lot of shame and lies. And so every morning the question he had me pray was, Lord, help me say the deepest, truest things to you. And I would [00:12:00] just sit there quietly and he would reveal the lies and the fears that were at the root of everything. And it was so freeing

Tara: that courage. I think people can misunderstand that. Living fearless or living free in your true identity means no fear. No, it means confess out the fear and partner with Jesus in it and move forward courageously that fear still might be present.

So it’s a misnomer. It’s a misunderstanding that we can’t move until there’s no fear. Right. And it’s. Confess the fear because you got it. You’re human, you’re alive, and where you felt free one minute, life happened the next. And it’s like God, it’s this ultimate connector. And we think we gotta clean up and figure it all out before interacting with God.

And he’s like, no. I want to interact with you in this human condition of all of you have fear. You daughters have fear, [00:13:00] so let’s talk about it every morning. That’s the self emptying, that’s the confessing, the truth telling. Boy, does that delight his heart, because he’s like, I already knew that was there.

I’m so glad that you trust me enough to tell me because it takes courage to speak that out. I hear a lot of Christians say, I shouldn’t talk like this. This shows that I have a weak faith. I should know better my life with Jesus. All he’s done for me. There’s a lot of guilt and there’s a lot of shame and we’re trying to eradicate the guilt and shame by saying speak the truth.

We all have fears. What are they? It’s beautiful connector. Now let’s get to work.

Yeah.

The truth. So, yeah, that’s beautiful, Kelly. Yeah.

Kelly: One of the things that I have I encourage other people to pray is Lord helped me to hold tight to your word until your voice is louder than my circumstances and your love is larger than my fears.

Because one of the things Jamie explains too, is that when we’re afraid and [00:14:00] neurologists talk about this a lot, that when we’re afraid we’re living in the back of our brain, the amygdala. But as we confess our fears, we’re able to move into the frontal cortex where we’re actually able to open up and receive God’s love.

But fear shut us down, right?

Tara: A hundred percent. Yeah. So it’s that courage. You just expressed how we move the oxygen and our energy. To the creative, like Jesus loves to enter into a place of fear and he loves like an elevator and escalator. He loves it. Like, okay, now let’s lift that up. You have the mind of Christ.

And I say to clients like as an identity exchange coach, let’s go off the grid with Jesus. What do I mean? Let’s not be logical and reason this out. Let’s go into our right brain. Let’s go into that prefrontal cortex. Let’s. really allow Jesus into all of it. We don’t want to just reason things through and be logical about things.

[00:15:00] We want to be creative and imaginative and contemplate and innovate. So in this moment, what is he trying to tell us? he always speaks truth as you have lots of experience, Kelly, and truth has a presence just like fear has a tangible presence and c’mon. I mean, we can hook up to that any moment.

It’s so easy, but truth. Coming from God, the truth teller, it takes us a little more like umph to believe it, to get there, to access it, not from him. It’s always around, but isn’t it interesting how it takes us a little longer to believe the truth that he’s speaking. And that’s the identity in who he says, Tara, you’re not stupid.

Tara, you’re not rejected Tara. You’re not, you don’t have to be whole in these certain successes. You’re not, your safety isn’t in your bank account. It’s like, what do you mean God? And it took [00:16:00] me a decade. It took me time to believe the truth of not only how he sees my circumstances, but how he sees me.

Kelly: That is so powerful. So you just talked about believing fears are easier. And one of the things Jamie Winship said, that’s because it takes no faith to believe a lie.

Tara: Yeah. No faith at all. Don’t we see it. It’s right there. There it is. Full agreement.

Kelly: Yeah. So when we recognize the lies and we just say that’s a lie, forget it. I’m not going to believe that. And then we have to activate our faith to believe what God is telling us is true. Like you said, we have the mind of Christ.

God knit us together in our mother’s womb. We have a beautiful identity that God put together in such a way that we can walk out our calling and reflect God’s heart in a way nobody else ever. Ever has done. It’s so amazing.

Tara: It is amazing. It’s a [00:17:00] tangible shift. Yeah. Move from fear to love or to truth.

Yeah.

Kelly: That’s so, so helpful. It’s very freeing when we can walk into that place. I’m going to tell a story about Salim from the book of that Jamie Winship wrote. Do you remember that story? Yeah. Oh, it’s,

Tara: I mean, I don’t know which one’s my favorite. They all seem to be my favorite, but this one’s a good one.

Yeah.

Kelly: Yeah. Okay. I’m going to try to tell this. I love this particular story because it’s pretty short, but it very clearly shows how our false identities can stand in the way of walking out our calling from the Lord. And we’ll talk about that in a minute, that our identity and our calling are two different things.

And I’ll let you explain that. But so Salim was living in a Muslim country. He needed a driver’s license. That’s the only way he. Could get a job that paid enough to provide for his parents. But the problem was that he was part of a discriminated against ethnic minority. Three times he tried, he’d go in with his [00:18:00] application, but every time the government officials saw.

His ethnicity, they would reject his application. It was a corrupt government. He had all these obstacles piled against him. It looked impossible. He also had no driving experience. And so he meets with Jamie Winship and Jamie says, well, let’s just pray. God, what do you want Salim to know about getting a driver’s license?

And so they sat there for quite a while as they waited. Jamie said, it felt like hours, but it was really just a few minutes, but it was very. Interesting how God spoke to Salim. The first thing he did was identify the false identities that Salim was living under. So he said, I’m hearing, I’m afraid I’m a failure.

I’m a disappointment. It is so interesting. And Jamie explained, okay, God wants to free you from those. Those are lies. The truth is that the unfair government policies, that’s not what’s standing [00:19:00] in the way of you getting a driver’s license because God can overcome any obstacle. Okay. But he speaks, he wants to speak to your true identity.

So first. We got to get your true identity in place. So Salim agrees to a daily spiritual practice where first of all, he will pray, confessing the false beliefs about himself and his fears. And then he would ask Messiah to lift the false identity and then ask God to speak to him through the Holy spirit about who he was in Christ.

Now, here’s what’s interesting is Salim at this point was not a follower of Jesus, But he had a very reverent view of God and a prayer. So I love this truth that Jesus speaks to people who don’t yet know him. And that’s how they come to know him. One of the things about Salim that helps us understand this story as well as that he never did well in school.

So after several weeks of praying through these [00:20:00] prayers and meeting with Jamie and reading the Bible with Jamie and studying scripture, One day he heard God speak to him and call him an intellectual scholar. And at first Salim is just shaking his head. No, that can’t be right. I must be hearing wrong.

But Jamie said, this is how God knit you together. And then. Finally, he was able to believe, well, maybe this is true. And he asked God for wisdom at one point, God, what do you want us to know about getting a driver’s license for Salim? And God spoke fairly quickly. And he said, don’t be afraid. Go to the office stand in line.

I am is with you. And so once again, he went exercising, activating his faith in God’s word and in who God said he was and the truth that God was with him. He went and he presented his application and astonishingly. An officer who [00:21:00] considered him an enemy accepted his application and said, okay, let’s go do your driving test.

And Salim is immediately afraid, has no driving experience. So he says, Jesus, what do you want me to know about this driving test? And he hears Jesus speak, love your enemy. Do good to those who hate you. And he just had this peace, fill him up and fill up that car. And he began to drive and a pretty crazy thing happened as he was driving.

. He noticed an injured cat on the side of the road. And he said out loud, he didn’t want to, he was afraid, but God was prompting him. I think we need to go back and rescue that cat. And the officer says, Well, if you’re God is telling you to rescue that cat, then we better go back.

And so Salim turned the car around. They went back. They scooped up the cat . They drove like speeding through the city [00:22:00] because the cat was dying and suddenly Selene became the best driver in the world

Tara: Nascar driver, right?

Yeah.

Kelly: Yeah. They get the cat to the vet. He is healed and he gets the emergency attention he needs and the officer says, you are the best driver I’ve ever seen you pass. And he got his license.

Tara: That is the way it works on this side of heaven. That’s the kingdom of God.

Kelly: So amazing.

So I’m wondering if you can kind of connect the pieces of identity fear. And calling for us. Can you explain that for us?

Tara: Yeah. . You know, first and foremost, Jamie knows the truth of who God is.

And it’s a mystery. We’re always uncovering the fullness of God, the fullness of the gospel message. But when Jamie as a conduit is inviting him into this truth already, it’s potent and then the prayers, the [00:23:00] voice activated prayers, it’s changing hearts of the police officer, of the. Person who’s guiding him to the gatekeeper of his future that we think like I’m stuck.

I’m stuck in this situation because this person is in the way this governmental system is in the way this empire, if you will, is in the way. And when we have a right view of God, even amount, the amount of a mustard seed, and it’s like, just pray into this, just even if it’s every day, the size of a mustard seed.

It’s going to make a difference. It’s softened hearts. It put the cat in the right spot. I mean, God works through all things. He knows the path ahead. So if you keep your eyes on the true identity of who God is, then you step into with faith. Trust is faith in action. So it’s All right, you spent time [00:24:00] marinating in this new truth that you were functioning from a place of lies and now you’re just trying it on for size.

This is who he says you are. Just keep trying it on for size and interact with him and pray and talk. We think too often prayer is not powerful, that it’s not a powerful action step. It is. And so it’s a preparation and then we move, it’s get up off your mat and walk. Now go back to that place.

Now go present your application again. And it, every door just unlocked as he kept moving forward in courage, fear was present. But he knew who to partner with. He knew who to be on journey with and his true identity before I even had a diploma or something that showed me evidence of this identity and what was the identity again, intellectual [00:25:00] scholar.

Well, what is showing me in this world that I’m an intellectual scholar? It’s move forward. It’s. Our true identity is discovered over time in community and the scripture I’m just marinating in is in specifically, it’s a good Samaritan in Luke chapter 10 and it’s, this is a neighbor, what that story that you just highlighted is how we are neighbors, what?

He’s our enemy. No, we are neighbors. We have great compassion for each other. Well, that connectedness, that connected worldview, not the empire disconnected, separate worldview. The connected worldview is saying, even who you think is an enemy and a block of your future can be your neighbor. Going to be done connected to the truth of who God is.

And moving forward with faith over time in community. I didn’t know that guy was going to, I didn’t know Jamie Winship was going to be [00:26:00] in my community. I didn’t know that, that guy that’s a stop in my, I didn’t know that enemy was going to be my neighbor in my community. And that’s. That’s where we little by little realize, wow, that was an intelligent move.

That was smart. Yes. Because you’re partnering with the Lord over time in your true identity. And it’s unfolding as you’re taking these faith steps. So I’ll pause there to see if I answered your question because I could go in so many different directions.

Kelly: Yes. That was a really good explanation.

So , this is what God is saying about who we are. The verse , Deuteronomy 31, eight. The Lord himself goes before you and will be with you. He will never leave you or forsake you. So don’t be afraid and don’t be discouraged. I am is with you. The great I am the almighty, the creator of the world, the creator of the universe.

The one who created you, who lives outside of [00:27:00] time, he knit you together for a specific purpose and he planted you right where you are for a specific time. And he is with you and wants you to walk into the freedom of who you are in Christ. You are, you have the mind of Christ. The moment you say yes to Jesus, his spirit indwells you and he is constantly continually Ministering to those deep places of wounds and lies and fears and wanting us to walk into freedom.

Just like John 10, 10 says the enemy came to steal, kill, and destroy. And that’s what was happening in Salim’s life. Salim was believing the lie that I’m stuck. And that was just a lie. He wasn’t stuck, but Jesus came that we might have life and have it abundantly. And as Salim placed his faith in Jesus, believed God’s words.

In the Bible he walked into his true identity and was set free from fears and lies. [00:28:00] So it’s biblical. It’s beautiful. This is how God wants us to operate. Right.

Tara: And I would like to add on that our true identity is from the day he knitted us together in our mother’s womb.

Kelly: Yes.

Tara: It’s always been there. Always. It’s who he made us to be. And so when we enter into this world through these human, you know, this mother and these parents, that’s the natural, that’s the human. And they give us they give us a name, that helps to identify us and call us when we need to be drawn closer, those names are important.

And then we’re also hearing all these other names that we talked about at the top of this episode. And but the name from The Maker is to be discovered over time. And it often doesn’t happen in childhood. I mean, there’s evidence of what we feel so free and [00:29:00] We’re excited to explore and there’s not a lot of caps, depending on our childhood, but there’s aspects of that.

That’s peeking out. And then we have these joyful memories that the Lord’s already interacting with us and wooing. I have stories about that before I even knew who he was. He was wooing me, that’s the John 10, he’s approaching the one at all times. He wants us to be connected to him to trust him to then reveal who it is. He says we are, and that’s biblical.

That’s the names are. You know, Saul to Paul all throughout scripture, Simon to Peter. And it’s a nickname, so it’s a name. It’s an endearing personal nickname. Mine’s now it’s Petra it’s rock. And I was walked through in 2015 ish. I was walked through a listening prayer and to hear, okay, what are the lies?

Confess out the lies. And you know, there’s other things that go around it, but what are the [00:30:00] lies you believe and allow space and time for Jesus to tell you the truth and exchange the lies for truth. And I just got this visualization and I learned to accept the beauty of my imagination. I was, I’m a believer.

I have the mind of Christ. I can trust my mind. It’s his mind. This prayer has been covered. It’s all oozing in Jesus. Yes. I saw the visual. I was confused by it, but over time in community, I’m like, wow, that’s how he sees me. And I didn’t believe that as a kid. But I could go back and then, oh, wow. I could see how I was strong foundation and the other thing I love to say about true identity is it’s also who he, it’s a state of being, it’s who he is for us first.

Yeah. So he calls me rock. He calls me Petra, you know, there’s descriptors strong foundation upon which much is built. And he [00:31:00] really sees us the way that maybe before we can even believe it. And then just checking it out, trying it out for size, like the story you shared. And for me, I went back and I looked at all the different bits of evidence Oh, I could see it being worked out.

I could see it forming and taking shape. I could, I can see that I wasn’t actually successful in my own strength. That was him being my rock. That was him being my strong foundation, no matter my attitude or what I was doing or what I wasn’t acknowledging yet. So I just love to acknowledge that this true identity Is unadulterated like the truth of it all that gold within us was there the day he crafted us in heaven.

Yeah. And it is a very exciting day when we get realigned with that truth.

Kelly: Yes, that’s so, so true. He [00:32:00] knew our name before we were ever created. which is so powerful for my twins because they look a lot alike.

And so they, we would say, God loves you so much. And they would shrug as teenagers and go, huh? He loves the whole world. And because people got them confused all the time, so they didn’t feel unique. And they, when I finally told them, God knit you together in my womb in such a way that you reflect God’s character and heart to the world in a way that nobody else can, nobody ever, you do that.

The way God created you to be, and that began to open their minds to really believe that God’s love for them was personal. I quoted a lot of teachings from Psalm 139 with such a personal description of how God walks with us, knows us, sees us, and ministers to us, and so they were finally able to believe okay, I’m loved.

It’s not just, you know, this general generic love, it’s personal and intimate.

Tara: [00:33:00] Yes, we’re all on that journey. I love that particular story and that echoes the human condition. So beautiful to, to really believe, Oh, it’s for me. Yeah. And it’s personal and like you had said earlier, I’m not sure if I’m jumping ahead, but it is different than the verb, than the doing of our identity, the calling.

It’s the way we operate. We want to operate from a place of truth, but we’re not dependent on others receiving or agreeing. You know, a lot of communities don’t necessarily have really stepped into the depth of the truth of who God says we are and gives us a, like a nickname and gives us a name so that when we are interacting with him, it’s like, this is personal, like your twins, like this is personal.

And then the interaction. with the other is personal. Call you by a different name than I call you. And it’s part of our ongoing journey. And it’s from the state of [00:34:00] being and believing that then we operate out of that truth. And that is what I wish I had. Like you said, sometimes with parenting, that’s also what I wish I had.

You know, when I was a principal or a teacher that I wasn’t operating out of my own false identity of my it’s in my efforts and it’s in my strength and You know, scarcity of time and money and resources and yeah, so it would be very different to go back and which we don’t have to, you know, we just we release that, but not function from a place of false identity feels much different to then go and function from a place of truth.

Kelly: Yes. And we see that again, like you were talking about, we see that biblically, the angel of the Lord came to Gideon, called him a mighty warrior and Gideon’s like, no, I’m the least I’m the weakest. I can’t do anything. And he had to learn to believe. This new [00:35:00] identity and walk in it. It was, he was very fearful, but the Lord was so patient and tender with him.

, the throwing out of the fleece, and God just very slowly walked him into the truth of his identity and walked him into this beautiful victory. And he became. The mighty warrior that God had already designed him to be and we see that with with Jacob too.

Like Jacob was a deceiver and then God changed his name to Israel as he walked him into the truth of being one of the patriarchs of the faith. It’s so beautiful. I love

Tara: how you can connect it so quickly, just so thoughtfully to scripture because this is rooted in scripture. This is true. And it’s a delight for us to be connected, even while we’re reading scripture from a place of this truth.

Cause often we’ll even read his written word from fear and we believe lies about him and [00:36:00] his true identity. We believe lies about ourself in this world and that inhibits us accessing the fullness of that written, you know, God inspired written word. So I just love those references are perfect.

Kelly: . And I want to add to that. It just made me think about how one time I heard someone ask the question, well, every time my daughter reads the Bible, she stays in the Old Testament. She just sees God is an angry God. And someone pointed out that’s probably because she’s living with the lie of being unworthy.

And she needs to have some soul healing to receive the truth of how deeply she is loved. I spent two years just sitting in scripture about how much God loves us. And it was so beautiful. , I’m going to get so emotional. I do too. When the spirit is alive and active. It’s God’s love that heals us, right?

It’s his love. He draws us. It’s his [00:37:00] kindness that draws us to repentance. It’s his love. And so when we read the Bible from a false identity or a false understanding of who God is, we miss God’s heart. We do.

Tara: He’s the mighty physician. His judgment is a place of doctor.

And so when he’s naming things, when he’s calling out things. It’s to heal. Yes. Never to condemn. Yes. So I’m not afraid of his judgment because I know that when he gently reveals the lies I’m believing, then he’s going to heal it. That’s why we don’t have to be afraid. To engage and go there. We’re going to go there.

But in our time of going there, that he always has the spirit of the Lord, the triune God always has a new gem, something new to share with us. That will bless the truth. That’s in compliment [00:38:00] what’s already there. Call even some verse, some phrases are to call it out more. Now that we remove that block, that lie, fear, guilt, shame.

Do you see the truth? And it’s a mirroring. It’s a mirroring of him and me and him, the vine and the branch. It’s a, that’s the freedom. That’s the connectedness. Like I often liken it to like a spiritual umbilical cord that never gets cut. I am connected to God and he is a compassionate God all through the Old Testament.

He’s a compassionate God who knows the truth. Who’s not afraid of any parts of our lives. He’s already like you already read in Deuteronomy. He’s gone up. He goes before us. He comes back and walks now with us. We have nothing to fear. We’re never alone. My phrase is no matter what, and even if no matter what happens.

And even if that [00:39:00] happens. I’m going to be there. And if it’s, if it incites a negative feeling and emotion or triggers something, not a problem. Cause I have just the exchange. I’ve just the remedy. To not just flip the script because we do it with our own thoughts. No, like an encounter with love.

Yes. We don’t partner with the fear that’s always readily acceptable and easy to access. Just the make of this world. But. Yeah, Kelly, it love is every where God is love. He’s everywhere. And if we just can learn to increase spiritual awareness and our intentionality with our thoughts and our feelings. We carry the lies.

We know we could feel it in a, like a pinch in our chest or something, or like an elephant sitting on our chest. Like there’s all the different feelings. I might be bringing that up. Cause that was yesterday for me. [00:40:00] But that is my body saying the Holy Spirit’s in me saying Tara, that’s not free.

That’s like a feeling of stuck or trapped or whatever it ended up being. And it’s an invitation into more and more truth. That’s always excavated and discovered because of his love. It’s so beautiful. Nothing to fear ever.

Kelly: Never. One of the prayers that we can pray is Psalm 139 verse 23.

That just says, search me and know me, God, show me if there’s anything standing in the way of receiving your love, because your word says at the end of Romans, that Nothing will ever separate me from your love, nothing, and that I can just open up my heart. I am always loved. I am always unconditionally, unstoppably, irrevocably loved.

And I want to walk in the truth of your love and not live with anything standing in the way. And so Tara, . Let’s close out our [00:41:00] conversation with communicating to people how they can surrender these lies and fears to the Lord.

Try to do it in some actionable steps that will bless their, you know, tomorrow they can access it.

Tara: Tomorrow, but Jamie’s book, identity exchange website, great places, great references to access this more deeply. But it is pausing in the moment, recognizing what’s going on in my body. It’s really about feeling it because then if I’m feeling and noticing where I’m feeling it. Then I’m getting in touch with it.

I could do it any time of the day. It doesn’t have to be in my quiet time, but that’s also an obvious focus time that we try to set aside. What am I feeling? Where am I feeling it? And how is it defining me? What might I be believing about myself because of this situation, because of this unpleasant emotion, it [00:42:00] tends to define us.

So if we just put language to it, I’m Exposed. I’m vulnerable. I’m afraid. I’m stuck. Whatever the, I am statement is, and we can feel that the importance of feeling it and naming it is then we access love. And if we have the belief that love is right here, present, always, it’s right, right here. It’s loved in surround sound.

So Jesus is among us. The Holy spirit is within us. And so it’s right here, the

Kelly: Perfect love casts out fear. So when we open our hearts to the truth of God’s perfect love, he dispels the fear.

Tara: We give him the, it’s almost the action of giving it to him is very powerful because it’s our choice.

It’s our surrendering it. Yeah. Amen. Amen. I mean, he loves to come towards us to, I mean, that happens, but [00:43:00] it’s this action of this is what I’m feeling sometimes even symbolic in my hands and I’m handing it over to you or I feel it leaving the burden or the elephant on the chest and I feel it leaving the body and I watch what Jesus does with it.

I give it to him and then I watch how my compassionate God who very much sees my situation more than I can even articulate with human words. And then I watch what he does with it. And then I receive truth. And sometimes it’s a symbolic like imagery or it’s something he’s handing me depending on, you know, how long I have to hang with them and receive from him.

But it’s as simple at, but we’re all different. Our minds interact with the spirit of the Lord differently. So sometimes it’s through imagery. Sometimes it’s through words. It’s not often audible, right?

Yeah. and so if it’s through scripture, whatever the receiving is. [00:44:00] It’s then saying, what do you want me to know about this truth? We want it personal because sometimes when I work with, and I work with a lot of people, but most are Christian and most know scripture, but it doesn’t exchange.

It doesn’t penetrate. It doesn’t get deeper. It’s the scripture can stay or anything else. It can stay logical. It could stay landing on the surface.

Kelly: Okay. so that makes sense

Tara: , what do you want me to know about this? And it’s in that engagement that he gives us more. And then do I accept it as a free gift? It’s the truth , by the end of that, not only are we receiving, but we’re also receiving, oh, so who do you say that I am? Now that I just received this truth, so I can now hear you more fine tuned the ears. Who do you say I am? And sometimes it’s just the complete opposite,

and sometimes it’s super personal and, [00:45:00] but it’s not always logical. We have to be okay with it, not making sense to us, but we’re going to take note anyway. But here’s the key. I leave knowing I felt a tangible shift. So if it started in my chest and I know I had that engagement and I received it as truth, I won’t feel the same feeling I had of the pressure I’ll feel lighter.

I’ll feel like, Whoa, I can breathe deeper. So that’s an example of knowing I just had an encounter with God.

Kelly: Yeah. I I just want to share a quick story to kind of pull this together. So my daughter who lives at home is 31 years old. I’ve shared this before on the podcast. She is profoundly deaf has Lyme disease and has been recovering, but still primarily living in her bedroom.

But the Lord is miraculously doing some things in her and walking her out of it. But her story is long and it’s hard [00:46:00] and has had, she’s had a pile of hardship in her life that has broken my heart. And so one day we were, Doing some prayer with a pastor from our church and this pastor was in prayer, walking her through some hurtful things in her life.

And some I’d never heard about. And as I heard, it just became so weighty for me and so heartbreaking. And I said to the Lord I am a failure as a mom, and I couldn’t even breathe. The weight of sorrow was so great, but I sensed the Lord just draw near, lift the weight off of me and say to me, this is not your fault.

This is her story. I’ve got her. I’ve got her. She’s okay. Trust me for the timing of her breakthrough. I’ve got her. And so God spoke identity over me. You’re not a failure. You didn’t mess up as a mom. This is not your fault. And just, [00:47:00] With love. He dispelled my fears, dispelled the lies and lessened the sorrow.

And so what you’re describing is paying attention to your soul and bringing that to the Lord in conversation,

Tara: not discounting our soul or our body, you know, our temple. They are indicators of what’s going on inside and the Holy Spirit is inside, and he’s just like in giving us indicators, sometimes we feel triggered and it’s like, Ooh, there it is.

Let’s have a, let’s have a talk. Yeah, let’s have a talk. Daughter or son, let’s have a talk. What do you want me to know? What do you want me to know? So the triggers aren’t something to escape or ignore or shame or guilt or pass off or compartmentalize, you know? It’s like, no, let’s have a talk. Let me tell you the truth of what’s going on and who you are and who I am.

Yeah.

Kelly: So would you close this in prayer? .

Tara: Yeah. Yeah. Father God, thank you so much for this sister in Christ, Kelly.

[00:48:00] Thank you for this community. Thank you, Lord, that you speak. Thank you to speak through your written word and through just the word that is within our mind safe and connected to you reflected in scripture. It’s the truth of who you are. So glad that you’re an alive and active God that, you know, us well, you knitted us together on purpose for a purpose, father God, and may every listener at this moment, feel a shift in their spirit in this truth,

open their eyes and ears to this truth. So thank you, God, for the truth of who you are. It is a delight to continue to learn more and more about your abundant nature, your goodness, your kindness, and compassion for us. I’m so excited for these listeners and for Kelly and I to continue to hear who it is you say we are in the kingdom [00:49:00] of God so that we can turn around and bless this world as you prepared for us.

We’re never on mission alone. Never. We’re in this with you. If that means what we do in our home with our loved ones, may we operate from a place of wholeness and truth of who you say we are. And as we go into this world, And our neighbor is right there and we just want to partner with you and loving that person drawing out the truth of who he or she is.

It’s this ongoing connection, true identity to the next. Just keep pulling it out and revealing it in each other. Thank you father for this connection. Thank you for making your words so attractive. And thank you for Kelly. Thank you for this podcast. Thank you for this vehicle that Kelly [00:50:00] shows up whole and her true identity, drawing people closer to the truth of who you are.

And one more time, Lord, so excited for the people listening that they become very aware of their truth and exchanging the lies for your love. It’s an exciting, freeing place to live. We pray all of this in the mighty name of Christ Jesus. Amen.

Kelly: Amen. Thank you so much, Tara. This was a wonderful conversation.

I loved it so much. I will put the links to Jamie’s book in the show notes as well as to identityexchange. com where he and his wife have a lot of other resources that you can connect to. Our life group is doing knowing rediscovered through the website, which is a small group Bible study. It’s beautiful.

Thanks again for being here.

Tara: Thanks for having me. Have a blessed rest of your [00:51:00] evening. You too.

If you were encouraged in your faith today, it’d be great if you’d help get the word out by subscribing, sharing with a friend or leaving a review. I’d love to hear from you. You can reach out through my website, kellyhall. org and pick up some free resources while you’re there. Thanks for listening to the Unshakable Hope Podcast.